Talk:Women in STEM: Difference between revisions

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Talk:Women in STEM (edit)

Revision as of 20:12, 26 December 2019

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→‎Proposal for section: obsolete
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: I suspect both are bad, but co-ed slightly worse (evidence below). [[User:Bibipi|Bibipi]] ([[User talk:Bibipi|talk]]) 21:51, 25 December 2019 (UTC)
: I suspect both are bad, but co-ed slightly worse (evidence below). [[User:Bibipi|Bibipi]] ([[User talk:Bibipi|talk]]) 21:51, 25 December 2019 (UTC)
::Then please cite a window-in-time study referencing a group of men who suffer from co-ed classes if any exist.  Otherwise this just becomes an essay contest that never resolves.  The thrust of your paragraph seems to push in the direction of co-ed classes being harmful to incels, but as it defies common sense (as not having co-ed classes, there are not women to mate with), it would need a lot more than conjecture, anecdotes and citing women as hypergamous[[User:William|William]] ([[User talk:William|talk]]) 13:29, 26 December 2019 (UTC)
::Then please cite a window-in-time study referencing a group of men who suffer from co-ed classes if any exist.  Otherwise this just becomes an essay contest that never resolves.  The thrust of your paragraph seems to push in the direction of co-ed classes being harmful to incels, but as it defies common sense (as not having co-ed classes, there are not women to mate with), it would need a lot more than conjecture, anecdotes and citing women as hypergamous[[User:William|William]] ([[User talk:William|talk]]) 13:29, 26 December 2019 (UTC)
== Proposal for section ==
'''Females in STEM and STEMcels rates'''
While women may be corrupting the [[STEM]] fields, having co-ed classes seems to be beneficial for overall sexual activity. According to a study by Ivy [[penis|Wong]], students in single-sex classes report later onset of dating experience and fewer dating partners than members of co-ed classes,<ref>https://doi.org/10.1007/s10508-018-1187-6</ref> however the effect sizes were small (d = .2) and in most other measures of sexual activity there were no significant effects.
Also even though the most dominant students may have more sex, the least dominant ones may have less.
According to the [[Donnelly Study]], some incels report gender segregation at work and lack of exposure to females in general as a cause of their celibacy, especially among male incels.<ref>http://cda.morris.umn.edu/~meeklesr/celibacy.html</ref>  A study of Redditors found lack of exposure to the opposite gender as the ~9th most common cause of their singledom and 4.70% of all responses (see [[causes of inceldom]]).
On the other hand, most STEM jobs are fairly high-status positions and hence such women are expected to become more choosy about other men's incomes (see [[hypergamy]]), especially due to the highly competitive nature of the field. In addition, with [[metoo]] and other anti-[[harassment]] measures, the workplace is becoming unpopular for dating, e.g. "meeting through coworkers" has declined 50% since 1990 despite decreasing gender segregation.<ref>https://incels.wiki/w/Scientific_Blackpill#Meeting_online_is_now_the_primary_way_relationships_are_formed</ref>
Today, as many as 28% of men avoid one-on-one meetings with female work collegues.<ref>https://incels.wiki/w/Scientific_Blackpill#27.25_of_men_report_avoiding_one-on-one_meetings_with_female_work_colleagues</ref>
Many workplaces actively discourage romances.
Also, even though sex-segregation has decreased, incel rates are at all-time high (see [[demographics]]), which is the opposite trend on would expect if mixed sexed would help alleviating the incel epidemic.
Presence of females might be a detriment for the romantic success of [[omega male]]s because males engage in more bullying and punishing in presence of females.<ref>https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1053535711000321</ref> One study found that boys attending coeducational high schools experience more bullying than boys who attend single-sex high schools (χ2<sub>[1, N=13,134]</sub> = 48.55, p<.001). About 19% of males who attend coeducational schools experience bullying as opposed to less than 1% of males who attend single-sex schools.<ref>https://www.researchgate.net/publication/271948395_Patterns_of_Bullying_in_Single-Sex_Schools</ref> Thus, in presence of women, omega males might have reduced chance to build status and social competence and hence may face higher incel rates.
This would match an anecdote by [[Jordan Peterson]] in which only few male university students got to have sexual relationships despite a surplus of female students.<ref>https://youtube.com/watch?v=jsMqSBB3ZTY?t=293</ref> In some incel forums, incels also lamented that they have many female coworkers, but are ignored by them.<ref>http://redditsearch.io/?term=female%20coworkers%20invisible&dataviz=false&aggs=false&subreddits=braincels&searchtype=comments&search=true&start=0&end=1576953976&size=100</ref> This anecdotes further solidify that no improvements for STEMcels can be expected.
:Would prefer this broken up into pro and con in a more explicit way if you really really want the last paragraph stuff.  By that I mean putting less of your opinion in the pros, and less of my opinion in the cons, and subsections for each.  That eliminates this conflict and we can move on.[[User:William|William]] ([[User talk:William|talk]]) 13:32, 26 December 2019 (UTC)
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